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BFCSA: Jenny Mack needs to actually "meet" a consumer. Wrong Choice Jen, call me........

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Jenny Mack CEO of Choice thinks FOS is a good system for consumers.  We deal with the end users of the services on a daily basis.  The long suffering victims of bank generated RESIDENTIAL MORTGAGE FRAUD.  We are not criticising Jenny Mack for her lack of knowledge in this area, as CHOICE mainly deal with manufactured products and not financial services.  BFCSA are at the coal face of dud financial products and services investigations.  

Choice do an excellent job but are restrained from "road-testing" financial products.  

How do you road test a mortgage and wait 3 years into a 30 year loan for the inevitable IMPLOSION of product?   

Jenny Mack needs to be careful not to comment on things she is unfamiliar with other than ridiculous and untrustworthy ASIC briefs.  I say this as I noted "Andy's comments" in today's comment section.    Also comments by Linda Sterling-Levis, at CCA Financial Counselling Service

If ASIC and FOS are considered more successful thank the UK then the UK must be in utter turmoil re handling of dodgy mortgage investigations.  FOS staff do an excellent job of trying to wade through 500 cases or more per week!  I am sure the Ombudsman is advising ASIC "there are bagfuls of systemic issues here.....have been since 2009."  ASIC then grossly mislead Parliament and state: "no systemic systems."  

Parliamentarians initially accepted this nonsense, but then called for Inquiry into ASIC.  Well that was predictable.  Some switched on Senators are less likely to take ASIC's word for everything they bleat out.  It refers to ASIC scrutinizing FOS and "FOS is mining the data it collects."

So why is none of the FOS data being made public?  Is the FOS chief Ombudsman misleading ASIC?  He is an ex from the ASIC gene-pool.  OR is ASIC receiving the truth regarding systemic issues from FOS and not passing it on to the Parliament?

FOS is not geared to handle grand theft by banks.  They are a system developed to handle "disputes."  FOS struggles at times and delays have escalated because of the prevalence of fraud, generated by Banks via their computerized and devious system of mortgage approvals.

The fraud is generated by the Bank's Computers, deliberately so.  Therefore the bankers' clear intention to deceive on a grand scale.

If the FCA Members, Choice CEO Jenny Mack and Professors at Uni do not know that FRAUD BY BANKS is rife in Australia then Australia system cannot be better than anyone else's, surely?  How can consumers make informed CHOICES when the people leading these industries and consulting with ASIC have no idea what is going on?

But isn't that the whole point of DISCLOSURE?  Disclosure of information to assist in informed decision making process?  One would have thought the disclosure of serious crime being committed is of serious concern and of paramount importance to tell consumers before they sign up.....................................................

Well maybe I am the odd one out here.

Chairman of the Australian Securities and Investment Commission, Greg Medcraft, on one hand says "Disclosure not working"….then tells Parliament “no systemic issues.”  Excuse Me?  We pay him how much?  $800K?

Andy recalls a previous SMH story.............................

Andy- Posted on Monday, July 22, 2013


A Professor says co-regulatory approach of FOS & ASIC where ASIC oversees FOS & has intervening powers is a successful-model while FOS manages day-to-day complaints.

She says the Australian approach is much more flexible and responsive than the British model, which is regulated solely by a government-appointed body.

One criticism of the ombudsman service is that it is missing the opportunity to provide consumers with transparent and useful information about complaints-handling processes.

Under the present reporting system, FOS does not identify or release any specific data on disputes that involve systemic issues or serious misconduct and the University of SA's Waye recommends that FOS should make more of this information available.

" Many people drop out of the FOS complaints process because of frustration with this process and confusion over the legal complexities," says the NSW managing principal of law firm Maurice Blackburn, Ben Slade.

Moreover, conflicted ~ Vicki Waye, a professor of law at the University of South Australia says--

a: " it's got access to data through all its individual complaints so FOS can mine that data and very quickly identify whether there are trends or issues that amount to systemic matters; and

b: because there is a good relationship of trust between FOS and its members, it is much easier for FOS itself to get access to any information it needs and to try and resolve the issues quickly and in a way that will be satisfactory to the regulator [ASIC] should it scrutinise the issue.''

Chairwoman of Choice, Jenni Mack -- a board member of FOS -- "says this illustrates the consumer group's support of FOS in its endeavour to deliver swift and inexpensive resolution of consumer disputes."  

''FOS is there to step in when banks are breaking the rules and because of this banks are regulating themselves much better than they were in the past … banks are more aware of the way they should be dealing with consumers - their customers,'' says Financial counsellor Linda Sterling-Levis, at CCA Financial Counselling Service

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  • doyla66
    doyla66 Tuesday, 23 July 2013

    If Jenny Mack is restrained from road testing financial products then who is doing the road testing?
    Answer: We are!
    We, the Australian consumers are the crash test dummies of financial products.
    There's a big flaw in the testing procedures, namely who is collecting the research data and what are they doing with it?
    Answer: ASIC is collecting the data and apparently burying it as deep as they can so no one will know about it for 25 years or more!!
    Just as well some of our Senators are on the page :D
    Wanted: journalists and interested others to request the ASIC FOS etc data on financial product failure through FOI - asap - to prevent further death and suffering through these faulty financial products. We've got the proof - Australian Mortgages a big fail for consumers, a big fail for financial product regulators, a monumental fail for those who have lost their lives, homes, families, health and limited savings in this experiment.
    And .... if we're the test subjects we should be paid or compensated for our services and out of pocket expenses in the line of duty while assisting ASIC and the Australian Government.
    No one told us this was a financial product experiment!
    Where is the consumer ethics committee?
    Who's responsible for this "Project" ?
    We didn't even get free pizza and coffee for being on the focus group! Unions? This is exploitation!
    No wonder I kept feeling like a guinea pig in some crazy experiment.
    Canberra must have been off their rockers to permit this to continue while taking the risk with the "collateral damage". Big time damages ...
    We have the proof.
    Looking forward to seeing the detailed findings from the FOI. Who's doing the story?
    Great post, Denise, - please keep asking the hard questions.
    I doubt you'll get straight or useful answers from the lily livered lot at ASIC - they should be shaking in their shoes by now ... and hunting for their passports ... applying for other jobs ...
    Good luck ASIC - you can run but you can't hide ... we've got you !

  • doyla66
    doyla66 Tuesday, 23 July 2013

    My personal experience with FOS only serves to cement the inconsistencies and incapabilities of the FOS trained staff.

  • doyla66
    doyla66 Tuesday, 23 July 2013

    FOS "blacklist" ?

    I can remember reading a FOS company complaint blacklist. One of the companies I complained about was top of the list. It was published in the national papers.
    I haven't been able to find a more recent blacklist ...
    Does FOS still do the lists of complaints or only the stats on complaint resolution (on their site under annual reports).
    And on the subject of annual reports what, if anything, are FOS doing about the very high number of complaints that don't go right to through the FOS process? There are underlying issues in these. How many would relate to the mismatch between the complainant and the challenge of going through the FOS system without a "hands on" support team to take the case through? It's not the fault of FOS, IMHO, it's something that those who believe the FOS system is enough need to look at thoroughly, or weather the blame for the system. Once again, gaps in the system. FOS maybe fine for those with Law degrees and experienced in EDR - FOS is often overwhelming for those with no experience, limited education, visual impairment, ill health and no money to pay an advocate. I'd like to hear the Consumer Federations thoughts on this.
    Also the reactions, almost hostility, some of us have encountered from FOS and COSL staff over our cases does nothing to make us feel better about using the system and disadvantages our chances of reaching a successful outcome. I understand they don't "do" fraud. What they may not understand, to the degree that is really needed, is that most of us have never "done" EDR before. Anxiety and the natural stress over Bank treatment and the risk of losing our homes or making a mistake at FOS doesn't help either. These are just facts of life, and factors in some of our cases. It's quite an upsetting experience at times, in my own experience, and incredibly frustrating when I can't get what I'm trying to say to FOS into some sort of order, cover all the points and feel "heard" and understood by FOS. It does feel like a hostile and negative environment at times, even though it's supposed to be a level playing field. Maybe it's all the rules, steep learning curves and high stakes in the EDR game. Hey this is my home and my life they're talking about, not a house that doesn't matter and can be sold up to feed the bottomless pit of Bank greed!
    Does anyone else feel this way about it?

  • doyla66
    doyla66 Tuesday, 23 July 2013

    Subject: YES SENT -- Committee (ASIC) Inquiry Online Submissions - Submission Confirmation

    Yes Lisa; right now FOS hierarchy silence (great) case-manager since alerted to FOS linked ING-forged-doc on ING letterhead--

    FOS forwarded the (draft/incomplete/privileged under FOS Rule 16.6-copy) document to ING Bank as standard procedure, however, obviously unwittingly that ING bank-officer would set about corrupting same doc by way of forge & utter, ---then send the forged copy back to FOS to ultimately "close (former) fos file"---as such, i have requested that former fos file (hardship) be "reopened" --case manager "opened" that door for me, having seen the evidence, which the FOS Legal Counsel had previous to appointment of case manager - suppressed, denied me justice, fairness, impartiality = my rights under FOS rules...

    I have "highlighted issues Senator Williams holds grave concerns-- the "cover-up" of indictable offences, forgery etc.

    But -- "if" -- FOS(legals) decide to knowingly participate in this "cover-up" of ING bank-officers criminal sojourn -- thats another matter -- ala, -- Senator Williams cautioned ASIC's Deputy Commissioner Peter Kell recently with respect to any potential concealing of an indictable offence -- (CommBank forgeries & ASIC failure to refer to authorities et al) --under New South Wales Crimes Act 1900 No 40 -- s.316

    Concealing serious indictable offence
    (1) If a person has committed a serious indictable offence and another person who knows or believes that the offence has been committed and that he or she has information which might be of material assistance in securing the apprehension of the offender or the prosecution or conviction of the offender for it fails without reasonable excuse to bring that information to the attention of a member of the Police Force or other appropriate authority, that other person is liable to imprisonment for 2 years.

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